Faulty People > Changing venue but not changing faith...

By Vez

Photos of Stephen Giovannini
AL 47 February 2000

It was so for all three of us! I, Esa, and Polare have for many years shared joys, excitement, anger, and pain on this journey of ours, commonly called Hip Hop, together we worked until ’97, the moment when for each of us I believe something new began.

The two of them moved to Milan, I, with Vigor, stayed in Varese...the Headquarters now no longer exists, but our journey continues... 

Vez: “Many people out there have been wondering since you became The President, maybe they are even a little worried by the threatening tone that such a name can have, should we be worried?’

Esa: “Ah yes, the President stuff is a bullshit that was born a few years ago when I was touring a lot with Fritz and Bean, it was the time when maybe Polar was staying home, you and Vigor had no head to go out at night together, we were finishing the record (“From the Seat” 1997, ed.) and at the same time Fritz was recording his first album with you, I had become a kind of spiritual guide. It had created that classic role-play between those who are just approaching something and those who for a thousand reasons represent a little bit the older expert. New people coming up, with the fact that they have a lot more curiosity and new energy, very often confronts you with unresolved issues and questions thus leading you to revise or rethink your positions; you end up with followers and at the same time critics who are attentive to your every move. No shit, between the different generations of those who practice Hip Hop there is always a minimum of confrontation and confrontation. So laughing and joking, since I was also flaunting it a little bit as an expert, I became ’The President.“ It is, however, a title related only to the concept of ”Bad People’ as a posse: I am the “President” of my click. At the limit, since many people often approach me to give me consensus by finding in me that crazy germ that characterizes a bit all Hip Hop fans in Italy and show me their esteem, the name stands to feed that kind of halo that the rapper is usually used to baste around his figure.“

Vez: “A name that fuels fascination, satisfies the classic ego of every mc, by the way the restyling of the name of Polar into Polaroid would not in fact confirm your alleged delusions of grandeur.”

Esa: “That's right, it's the upgrade of Polar. There is the name of the brand of photographs and the trip of Polare for Japanese stuff, of robots; Polaroid-droid in short the game is there. Also because Gente Guasta has obvious points of contact with Otierre and at the same time it has a little more ’roughness,‘ a little more aggression, the result of all the stresses we experienced after the change. So it was natural to give ourselves a new look.’

Vez: “Aggressiveness that is also found in the newly released new album “La Grande Truffa Del Rap,” especially when compared to the previous episode of “Dalla Sede.””

Esa: “Aggressive but also paranoid in at least a couple of episodes. Also more provocative for sure. While the previous one was geared toward the concept of ‘building a nation all under the same groove,’ and although I realized that with all that work and even Micsmen's work a large group of fans of the thing had been created, the Italian situation was far from the utopia of the nation under the same groove. The more things went on, the more the jealousies and contradictions of this whole situation became even more apparent. That's kind of the thing about this Hip Hop?!!’

Vez: “Yes, I was referring to all the allusions that usually don't drive me crazy as a listener, but here they have a bit of a self-analysis feel to them: take for example your quote about giving back to Hip Hop what Hip Hop gave you. It's very strong, profound, and beyond the issue of who should then decide your debt, etc., etc., it seems to me to be a good concept to think about.’

Esa: “It's stuff that's in Underground Worlds.“

Vez: “By the way beautiful is the atmosphere throughout the piece, thanks also to a particularly apt base.”

Esa. “Yes, it's a beat produced by that crazy guy Skizo, but maybe we'll talk about the producers later so we can promote the whole thing. So the rhyme says exactly, ’Everyone takes many don't give back, so the proudest strike when these insist.“ This is the very spirit of defense, typical of this culture. There is no escaping it, despite the fact that this is a music born to entertain but also with a whole culture with its own canons, its own notions that people have to learn. There are many reference records to the above that are also useful to understand when Hip Hop is made exclusively to go in the charts or as a real expression. I'm not just talking about records but also videos, movies...there is a ton of stuff to know. Background is not something you can gloss over! Honestly, I think it's only fair that this business of defending Hip Hop be taken with due caution, the constant blaming between groups can lead to losing sight of the fact of making music per se.”

Vez: “Perhaps we have all been working too long developing individual realities that are too far apart?”

Esa: “It happens, no use twisting the knife in the wound, the constant clashes have fueled the need to experience one's own dimension of Hip Hop especially with friends and away.” 

Vez: “A kind of obligatory passage.”

Esa: “It's a transition, but I think it's ’normal.‘ The real observation is that the poison over these years has been increasing rather than decreasing, maybe everyone has noticed.’ 

Vez: “I was wondering then what the solution was, although I honestly think it's impossible to come out of our talk.”

Esa: “In fact, I found myself at a certain age reflecting on the continued lack of gratification and the energy sparked by the passion that still moves so many people. I don't know if there is a solution, but I think I can give a piece of advice to everyone by telling them to keep as gold the bonds born from this experience and not to be looking for too many connections because then it will be impossible to maintain them. In fact, in the piece “Be Careful” with Dominican I say “too many open doors and you get lost,” in retrospect, even though I may sound like the wrong person to talk about it, I advise people to never sacrifice their personal relationships for their artistic growth, it doesn't do any fucking good.”

Vez: “The problem widens when there is real business to be handled.”

Esa: “I think you have to take a good look at the whole business thing. In rap certainly the issue is more present, in dance and writing there you find people doing Hip Hop outside of any probable business possibilities.” 

Vez: “Definitely the music part has many more opportunities.”

Esa: “That's right. Being a mc provides many opportunities...” 

Vez: “Except for getting pussies, always fugitives in the environment.”

Esa: “No, look a lot of little boys and girls are coming up lately, of course it's not our generation's thing. Right now the beating of the crates and snare drums on the samplers is starting to get a lot of young ladies dancing. Then mc's with a lot of women are part of the tradition.” 

Vez: “And that would appease many tempers.”

Esa: “You say! Come copious young ladies to the events when there are. The party without young ladies has no meaning. As for artists, it's better for them to attend jams always equipped with the best techniques always ready to elevate it. Don't go to the events spazzed out, always look for the fotta to make a difference. The provocation of “The Great Rap Scam” lies in this in fact. Being a business that allows access to a whole bunch of things, often and often rap instead of moving forward risks fossilizing and adapting only to market needs. Every time you make a record you often find yourself dealing with this non-knowledge of the industry.”

Vez: “Maybe it's that big numbers don't recognize quality.”

Esa: ” You say the quality of Hip Hop?” 

Vez: “Artistic quality I mean, often what sells does not reflect the real artistic standards of the genre it represents. Maybe even in America it's like that, look at Will Smith etc. etc.”

Esa: “It's about running your own business, perhaps giving up raising the bar. However, it is not just a question regarding style, although this is a good field in which to compare. Let's say that apart from a few rare cases we are still not talking about people with exclusive and absolute truths to communicate, in fact often and often the topics are common among everyone and the real difference is not in what you say, but how you say it. In general I could say that this is not the time for Hip Hop with big content in Italy. Or at least this is a little bit my view at the current state of things, I hope to be proved wrong soon.’ 

Vez: “Definitely if we talk about universal content. Instead, I think there are many people who can write well and still make people think, and you are one of those. Artists who can have style and content.”

Esa: “Certainly now there is a need to recognize each other through jargon communication, which certainly limits the scope of those interested to only insiders. However, it is a big strength and belonging point that characterizes the whole peninsula. It is kind of what sets you apart from others the moment you decided to come out of the closet or were flashed by this passion. Now a lot of people find their identity in that. Think of people who shoot a lot of miles to get together to hear records, smoke, draw... without it necessarily being about conventions and/or partying. It's two sides of the same coin.’

Vez: “Yes, you exclude yourself from the crowd to still have an identity in the small pack.”

Esa: “A lot of people unplug from their daily routine thanks to Hip Hop. Thus feeling like a more constructive person -- of course we're talking about some.”

Vez: “Well of course, Hip Hop is also made up of people and as such it's not like we are all good, good, beautiful and so on.”

Esa: “Hip Hop was born to give people a push, if you are a peso, your way of carrying yourself toward culture will be just that. We don't mask it with goodness, many people are rude-boys. The environment is often bad, there is distrust, competitiveness, desire to stand out.”

Vez: “Contradictions also fueled by a certain frenzy, maybe we all ran too fast.”

Esa: “If you are referring to the artistic careers of some of us, I will tell you that they are often meteors. My shelves are full of records of people with meteoric careers. Even many who inspired me like Ed Og or Dres (of the Black Sheep) who were coming out at the time when I had also become active in the field and no longer just a spectator...a figure, however, not to be underestimated in Hip Hop (the spectator precisely).”

Vez: “In fact having more and more of them wouldn't be bad at all.”

Esa: “Exactly. However, many of the people from before are doing their things maybe without any particular hype but with dignity and ability. Kind of like I feel like I am doing right now. Not because of my age, I think I'm in a middle state, but also because of the continuous emergence of many capable emerging artists who are not only following the outward side of things but also giving new and real stimulation.’ 

Vez: “Do you feel you have become a reference point?”

Esa: “Here I would like to take this public opportunity to tell everyone not to follow us because we are lost.”

Vez: “I meant in an artistic sense.”

Esa: “Studying some references is a step that can help you discover your strength. It is a step that many people have already taken, and now there are many very good artists with big individualities. Now thanks to new technologies everything has become more accessible is the realities are multiplying. I travel a lot and there are big innovations around. Anyway, it's kind of time to talk about the record.’

Vez: “Yes, but are there other topics in the record?”

Esa: “There are nothing but spoiled visions of the current landscape. All of mine and Polare's rhymes reflect the questions we have been asking ourselves on this journey, continuously joined by many friends who have brought new energy and insights. In the opening with Uomini Di Mare we ask precisely who is the best mc and what are the canons to be able to recognize him. It is one of the cues of the ’big con‘. The title of the album takes directly from the title of a Sex Pistols record (’The Great Rock'n Roll Scam,“ ed.). Rap has always had many points of contact with punk, precisely because of the fact that it is a music not exactly based on the technique of real musicians, but on the energy related to the extreme need to want to communicate with the means at hand. Very often in a non-canonical way and with a revolutionary spirit. So much so that in our record you can find many different and opposing aspects. You find there a piece made only with cymbals (”Tappa Dopo Tappa“ played by DJ Inesha) and rapped by Polare...”

Vez: “In fact many people will wonder why there is no solo piece of yours on the album, maybe they will be sorry.”

Esa: “You know,i followed the music production part a little bit more and then we thought we would share the different tracks. Actually we are almost never alone there are a lot of featuring. In the end we were often at our house with a lot of people without having outside of music anything else interesting to do.’ 

Vez: “Always going back to the talk of real connections that we were talking about earlier.”

Esa: “Yes, look at the important link we have with the guys from Germany-Torch, Zulu Sound System, Toni L and Boulevard Bou. Torch, ex-writer, Zulu King, sure discovery next year as mc, is also a good producer. He is an innovative, very open-minded person who helped me consider many important issues related to this Hip Hop disease that often makes you lose your real perspective on life. He is featured in two pieces (’The Original Transmission Of Ruin“ and ”The Two Hemispheres“) and one also features Koolizm even from Australia.”

Vez: “Definitely in one of the least canonical participations on the entire record.”

Esa: “Yeah, I would say we really beat the shit out of it on this record. We got a lot of things off our chests, and even the sound of the record is often so raw that it's really reminiscent of self-productions. We often aimed for substance rather than form. That's because in the beginning the record itself was not meant for official distribution, then now V2 takes care of it and surely some Christian will find it more easily. However, the record comes out with Niente X Niente, La Pina's label, let's say yet another experiment of a small Hip Hop label. I take this opportunity to wish all these small realities a prosperous future, also because it seems to me that they are the only ones who can guarantee particular organizational support for the artist.’

Vez: “Maybe we wish everyone to be able to grow and start making a difference.”

Esa: “I am sure that 2000 will be the year of truth. We will definitely see the first results.”

Vez: “Are you sure?”

Esa: “Yes, yes. Boh, we'll see how effective it is. In Italy we basically find ourselves fighting pop music, not even that easy a war with all the issues attached. From my tours around Europe I have discovered how the Italian record market is among the most untamable. What's more, we wander in the meanderings of this market a bit like renegades, rather than having an influence on it we just spoil some of its mechanisms.’

Vez: “You know then not to go close to 50,000 copies with this album.”

Esa: “Ours is a Hip Hop record and in some ways not even that canonical. There are episodes maybe able to please more everyone, but already the fact that it was conceived very freely through meetings with people who passed by the house, gives you an idea of how it can sound. The various collaborations are one of the driving forces behind this record. With Next for example, we worked on three tracks by spending some time together and it was a great experience. We stayed at his house, in his studio. It was a nice situation, we talked a lot and about everything, watched movies, videos, listened to a lot of good music, even dicked around and it helped to pull out a couple of gems for the record.’

Vez: “I firmly believe that being able to meet and be able to dialogue is a great formula for confrontation and growth.”

Esa: “Absolutely. We with everyone we have worked with have developed a very good feeling. They are all people we admire from the youngest to the oldest. In them we have recognized let's say something more than what we have found on average around. It must be said, however, that there are many missing that we would have liked to have had, also because a triple album could not be done and then maybe everyone will criticize the presence of so many guests.”

Vez: “Personally, it seems to me that you two come out a lot as protagonists in the work.”

Esa: “Good thing. We actually weren't doing much calculating. People came there with ideas and enthusiasm and threw everything into our project. Look at the case of Rome Zoo, they all swooped in after a concert in Veneto and in one day we shot ‘this seven-minute jam on a base made long before with Bou. The result may not have a classic song structure but it has all the typical spirit of the Hip Hop jam. The same goes for the pieces with the members of Souterrain. There is a beautiful episode called “Missionaries, Visionaries, Millionaires” over a base by Next with a featuring of Rival and a nice verse by Rae, who is famous as a writer but also a very good surprise in rap. He brought that real, raw intensity that only a certain kind of living can translate into rhyme, the same for Rival and it all blends perfectly with Maurizio's base. Also featured are Defi-J and Pitcho from Belgium. With the former in “Programmed To Kill” we tackled, in a completely delirious way, the eternal dilemma that exists between maintaining a positive direction and seeking one's own elevation with reality and the dicks of everyday life.”

Vez: “There is indeed a lot of your everyday life in this album. 

Esa: “I hope so, it's still a spoiled vision, so I don't know how many people will want to approach it.”

Vez: “It is not a sunny and purposeful record, however, I was favorably surprised that this work seems to mark a kind of hypothetical end of the line with certain arguments and certain discomforts.”

Esa: “There is actually not all this calculation behind the songs on the record, we were much more instinctive in all of this. Maybe that was the starting mood. There is only one song that may seem lighter (“Soul, Soul, Soul!... I Know”) with a lyric though that is sincere and not even that accommodating, kind of a high five that we wanted to give to people who believe in this, put their heart into it and rhyme after rhyme, song after song adds a piece to the whole thing.”

Vez: “It seems to me that the figure of Alien Army is strongly present, since we have mentioned them before as well.”

Esa: “There has been strong support from Skizo, Inesha and Alien Army, I have often found myself following the fotta and the aggressiveness with which these people study the scratch technique to continue to evolve it and it has often been one of the biggest motivators to continue, even more so than listening to the latest rap record out there. Skizo has been able to paint weighty scenarios with very emotional underpinnings and a style that is now characteristic of him. It was only natural that he would rejoin the project since they had already worked with him on two breakbeat albums that are blowing up in the turntablist circles. It seems that a lot of people get stuck in established standards and do not seek their own originality. I think you always have to keep in mind that the heaviest, most important challenge is the one with yourself, to prove to yourself that you are still able to progress.”

Vez: “You need a strong maturity to be able to do this, and maybe 15 years is not enough.”

Esa: “In a way this is also true although now it seems to me that you have to grow up faster and faster. We, however, a little bit of childish recklessness we have always maintained, also to continue to feel creative, however clearly more and more stances are being demanded and different responsibilities have to be faced. I hope, however, that we have not lost our grit, the kind that usually characterizes the early work of certain artists. In many episodes (’Who's The Clown,“ ’The Big Scam”) I found myself venting with respect to certain classic questions of growing up a man and toward which I still have no answers. This role then as a public speaker led me to face a lot of problems and from there came the more or less veiled criticisms of the record, the even uncomfortable provocations toward which none of us felt like continuing to put on a good face.“

Vez: “We have to conclude: tell me something about the closing piece, “The Combo,” with Sean, since we worked on it together a few years ago.”

Esa: “This is one of the many disaster masters we had in the drawer that had not yet seen the light of day. Despite being a ruff-mix from ’97 I feel like it gives some serious kicks even now. With Polare, Sean and Inesha we've been a delinquent collective for a couple of years and we had to have them on the record. Then your base is great... To finish I wanted to take the opportunity to say hello to Falco and Tommaso Feraboli for making the video-cult of “Armed Struggle” and the guys at Workin’ Class who are taking care of our website, drop by: www.otierre.it”